From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from mail-pl1-f176.google.com (mail-pl1-f176.google.com [209.85.214.176]) by mx.groups.io with SMTP id smtpd.web11.12766.1675214303288945455 for ; Tue, 31 Jan 2023 17:18:23 -0800 Authentication-Results: mx.groups.io; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=IlBzcCyY; spf=pass (domain: gmail.com, ip: 209.85.214.176, mailfrom: pedro.falcato@gmail.com) Received: by mail-pl1-f176.google.com with SMTP id h9so8325262plf.9 for ; Tue, 31 Jan 2023 17:18:23 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=C28yETlcpi/ScUAszYkiF4HLLlZj4M5UJoYSW9KNCjQ=; b=IlBzcCyYHE2J5g9sXxfiIWGfA7xzfAGPasr+Bu/v1g/O5qFAAExtGGFZB57dqAHeIv XGFOsTyugbWgDvpI4Q/D4vrwMgTqbjAyvJEn2QQ+AbNrvl84BYtHcKFEDRcId0SambDo I90A37vGoXP1oybYP8oQ6Np1ZWefT10Yt7tGsguUDsDFObvt50kcB56n2MuXUEKsaZQV G0+85yaBgxoPqauDi4TZwhLmWvvNg7sLnDi/zcHsheocubs1Ur61w4RxP1yk1uiM4YCn 0uAXwmrIn2OJbiAkpN8RDL5SwupI+Mycqwntb5QDpY30cCrkeP2SKA2I7p2pMXcjcawb XYLg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=C28yETlcpi/ScUAszYkiF4HLLlZj4M5UJoYSW9KNCjQ=; b=5D8T2NHSMknellGkaZPQ19l8ZpCop5aQxVTkD8dWq7OOc4ryDUh1jlLGYmA5laXoyM 8wm9rpGvMqkA617aWKCqJh+c0EGKg17iIRt0yZHv3hs+qr4qIdTwa0yA/YAuSDpA5wyZ HsMvjuSDQ2j43qzieqHzGKmDirGv8NZPr/nYF0J5vrjmoo1wIMVUbDUjvOwfnd1Jf2v2 JlHVfpXiRJJN5fVcyRvuSOVIYYacvOXfn7AbAr2Ev4JqwIa9OMZpQb9cDsbSpt1H90EX RYMqYpJRrrGHmkjpM0XwpZN4ZaU7hlc/ekAFUocD7OYWT+no1QbqEEQJn/NZHJWSBMgT EMzg== X-Gm-Message-State: AO0yUKWmi91eMrPkAUlIux8TRUyuc5Vv8sjgOUcHx8asJEZXZcGgwAQv r4cSfiZfrYcQM7T4IEIwgVgASuAkviFnik8lSjo= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AK7set+DJiAYRLc3KNSKOuIXiyk1CCf0Sf2nnIUmjZjhtAsv6jABmQ9XJ2MB9qtgZhdmzfHToCNTlzsXykfqaJuyjro= X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:ce86:b0:196:237f:164d with SMTP id f6-20020a170902ce8600b00196237f164dmr191579plg.14.1675214302537; Tue, 31 Jan 2023 17:18:22 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: "Pedro Falcato" Date: Wed, 1 Feb 2023 01:18:11 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [edk2-devel] MinPlatformPkg question To: "Kirkendall, Garrett" Cc: "devel@edk2.groups.io" , "Oram, Isaac W" , "Chiu, Chasel" , "Desimone, Nathaniel L" , "Gao, Liming" , "Dong, Eric" , "Bobroff, Zachary" , "Zimmer, Vincent" X-Groupsio-MsgNum: 99374 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="0000000000006d062805f3993921" --0000000000006d062805f3993921 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000006d062505f3993920" --0000000000006d062505f3993920 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Tue, Jan 31, 2023 at 7:28 PM Kirkendall, Garrett < Garrett.Kirkendall@amd.com> wrote: > [AMD Official Use Only - General] > > > > While I can work with Fsp named items in the MinPlatformPkg specification, > I assumed the UEFI/edk2 team and maintainers might be amenable to making > the specification more generic. One of my concerns with Fsp named FVs is > that critical core edk2 components are specified in them like PeiCore is > specified in FvFspM.fv, etc. There is only one guaranteed vendor > implementing FSP and therefore it might be better to have more generic > names which could attract more adopters more easily and reduce confusion. > Maybe there could be specified alternate names for non-FSP implementations? > Hi, To be clear, you are right that renaming things from FspX (and other possible examples) is a good idea. It's just not really a hindrance (despite silly politics), the docs are. You do not need the FSP to use MinPlatform. If you want to talk about real problems, we can start by mentioning that MinPlatform docs are not really all that great. They: 1) Mention Intel and Intel platforms all that time (why? this is supposed to be vendor agnostic) as well, almost assuming you're an Intel platform at points 2) Do not go in much depth about creating your own MinPlatform (and subsequently OpenBoardPkg) from scratch, and assume you already have an OpenBoardPkg to simply copy from 3) Lack simplicity and conciseness in many points All of this may very well slow adoption. As far as I know, on the QemuOpenBoard GSoC project the spec was mostly very underutilized except some bits like the list of required modules. > Having FSP in the name would imply that the product supports FSP when it > does not. > > > > I'm looking forward in time as much as possible where this specification > could encompass ARM, RISCV, etc. and provide similar useful items > MinPlatformPkg can provide to x86 platforms. > MinPlatform is AIUI at the moment pretty x86 PC centric. It requires components from PcAtChipsetPkg, UefiCpuPkg (which as you may know, is x86-only/mostly despite the name). Also requires a bunch of components like SATA and USB support which may not be wanted or needed in e.g a smaller riscv64 platform. It assumes a bog-standard PC environment where you need all sorts of features and components and drivers. Something I would personally love would be all sorts of reduced booting in MinPlatform (as in boot-to-OS-but-load-it-from-flash, etc. Many options), but it's probably far away still. I look forward to the next level of unified flow/structure that Minimum > Platform can provide to the industry. > > > > *GARRETT KIRKENDALL* > > > *----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------* > > Facebook | Twitter > | amd.com > > > > > > Words to live by: "Slow is Smooth. Smooth is Fast." > > > -- Pedro --0000000000006d062505f3993920 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Tue, Jan 31, 2023 at 7:28 PM Kirkendal= l, Garrett <Garrett.Kirken= dall@amd.com> wrote:

= [AMD Official Use Only - General]

=C2=A0

While I can work with Fsp named items in the MinPlat= formPkg specification, I assumed the UEFI/edk2 team and maintainers might b= e amenable to making the specification more generic.=C2=A0 One of my concer= ns with Fsp named FVs is that critical core edk2 components are specified in them like PeiCore is specified in Fv= FspM.fv, etc.=C2=A0 There is only one guaranteed vendor implementing FSP an= d therefore it might be better to have more generic names which could attra= ct more adopters more easily and reduce confusion.=C2=A0 Maybe there could be specified alternate names for non-FS= P implementations?

=C2=A0
= Hi,

To be clear, you are right that renaming thing= s from FspX (and other possible examples) is a good idea. It's just not= really a hindrance (despite silly politics), the docs are. You do not need= the FSP to use MinPlatform.

If you want to talk a= bout real problems, we can start by mentioning that MinPlatform docs are no= t really all that great. They:
=C2=A01) Mention Intel and Intel p= latforms all that time (why? this is supposed to be vendor agnostic) as wel= l, almost assuming you're an Intel platform at points
=C2= =A02) Do not go in much depth about creating your own MinPlatform (and subs= equently OpenBoardPkg) from scratch, and assume you already have an OpenBoa= rdPkg to simply copy from
=C2=A03) Lack simplicity and concis= eness in many points

All of this may very well slo= w adoption. As far as I know, on the QemuOpenBoard GSoC project the spec wa= s mostly very underutilized except some bits like the list of required modu= les.
=C2=A0

Having FSP in the name would imply that the product = supports FSP when it does not.

=C2=A0

I'm looking forward in time as much as possible = where this specification could encompass ARM, RISCV, etc. and provide simil= ar useful items MinPlatformPkg can provide to x86 platforms.<= /p>


MinPlatform is AIUI at t= he moment pretty x86 PC centric. It requires components from PcAtChipsetPkg= , UefiCpuPkg (which as you may know, is x86-only/mostly despite the name). = Also requires a bunch of components like SATA and USB support which may not= be wanted or needed in e.g a smaller riscv64 platform. It assumes a bog-st= andard PC environment where you need all sorts of features and components a= nd drivers.

Something I would personally love woul= d be all sorts of reduced booting in MinPlatform (as in boot-to-OS-but-load= -it-from-flash, etc. Many options), but it's probably far away still.

I look forward to the next level of unified flow/str= ucture that Minimum Platform can provide to the industry.

=C2=A0

GARRETT KIRKENDALL

---------------------------------------------------= ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----

Facebook=C2=A0|=C2=A0= =C2=A0Twitter=C2=A0|=C2=A0=C2=A0amd.com=C2=A0=C2=A0

=C2=A0<= /u>

=C2=A0

Words to live by: "Slow is Smooth.=C2=A0 Smooth= is Fast."

=C2=A0



--
Pedro
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