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Sun, 29 Oct 2023 15:42:45 +0000 From: "Yao, Jiewen" To: Laszlo Ersek , "devel@edk2.groups.io" , "pedro.falcato@gmail.com" , "Kinney, Michael D" CC: Andrew Fish , Leif Lindholm , "Warkentin, Andrei" , "West, Catharine" , "Bi, Dandan" , "Daniel Schaefer" , David Woodhouse , "De, Debkumar" , "Dong, Eric" , "Jiang, Guomin" , "Wu, Hao A" , James Bottomley , "Wang, Jian J" , "Justen, Jordan L" , Julien Grall , Peter Grehan , "Zhang, Qi1" , "Ng, Ray Han Lim" , "Stefan Berger" , "Hou, Wenxing" , "Lu, Xiaoyu1" Subject: Re: [edk2-devel] [Patch 1/1] Maintainers.txt: Update based on active community members Thread-Topic: [edk2-devel] [Patch 1/1] Maintainers.txt: Update based on active community members Thread-Index: AQHaCeM1LrZM/wTLG0uaCBqhn9AFpLBgCBiAgABc0PCAAGR3gIAAHeTw Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2023 15:42:45 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20231028192330.1031-1-michael.d.kinney@intel.com> <99615ab9-f669-5ac8-fafd-f154e8af5da8@redhat.com> In-Reply-To: <99615ab9-f669-5ac8-fafd-f154e8af5da8@redhat.com> 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devel@edk2.groups.io,jiewen.yao@intel.com List-Unsubscribe-Post: List-Unsubscribe=One-Click List-Unsubscribe: X-Gm-Message-State: aYlTXOV3yl7bchBdLCx3qHCSx7686176AA= Content-Language: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-GND-Status: LEGIT Authentication-Results: spool.mail.gandi.net; dkim=pass header.d=groups.io header.s=20140610 header.b=vE1KMggt; spf=pass (spool.mail.gandi.net: domain of bounce@groups.io designates 66.175.222.108 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=bounce@groups.io; dmarc=fail reason="SPF not aligned (relaxed), DKIM not aligned (relaxed)" header.from=intel.com (policy=none); arc=reject ("signature check failed: fail, {[1] = sig:microsoft.com:reject}") > I'd say that's pretty close. A reviewer role is a request for keeping > the reviewer in the loop. [Jiewen] I am disappointed on that. To me, that is NOT a real reviewer. See below description on what is "code = review". https://google.github.io/eng-practices/review/ https://about.gitlab.com/topics/version-control/what-is-code-review/ Our definition seems more like *a notification receiver*, instead of a real= code reviewer. I would say, it is a very misleading definition. Thank you Yao, Jiewen > -----Original Message----- > From: Laszlo Ersek > Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2023 9:48 PM > To: devel@edk2.groups.io; Yao, Jiewen ; > pedro.falcato@gmail.com; Kinney, Michael D > Cc: Andrew Fish ; Leif Lindholm ; > Warkentin, Andrei ; West, Catharine > ; Bi, Dandan ; Daniel > Schaefer ; David Woodhouse ; > De, Debkumar ; Dong, Eric ; > Jiang, Guomin ; Wu, Hao A ; > James Bottomley ; Wang, Jian J ; > Justen, Jordan L ; Julien Grall ; > Peter Grehan ; Zhang, Qi1 ; Ng, > Ray Han Lim ; Stefan Berger > ; Hou, Wenxing ; Lu, Xiaoyu= 1 > > Subject: Re: [edk2-devel] [Patch 1/1] Maintainers.txt: Update based on ac= tive > community members >=20 > On 10/29/23 09:05, Yao, Jiewen wrote: > > Those are great questions. I also would like to understand: > > > > 1) What is definition of "actively participating in their roles"? >=20 > Here are the definitions of Maintainer and Reviewer, from > "Maintainers.txt": >=20 > M: Package Maintainer: Cc address for patches and questions. Responsibl= e > for reviewing and pushing package changes to source control. > R: Package Reviewer: Cc address for patches and questions. Reviewers he= lp > maintainers review code, but don't have push access. A designated Pa= ckage > Reviewer is reasonably familiar with the Package (or some modules > thereof), and/or provides testing or regression testing for the Pack= age > (or some modules thereof), in certain platforms and environments. >=20 > > Is there any enforcement or just volunteer work? >=20 > I see the Maintainer role as a service to the community, with some > benefits granted in return. The "service" part should be clear. The > benefit is that you are kept in the loop, and sometimes (when you must) > you *can* say "no". (According to some seasoned reviewers, the one real > power of a maintainer -- not to be abused! -- is "saying no".) A > maintainer that's present helps set the focus, keep regressions out, > gives advice when needed, and so on. >=20 > Enforcement would be nice (haha), but it never works. You can't force > people to help, especially if their dayjob instructions oppose their > upstream community responsibilities. That's fine; in such cases my > request is always: if you can't help, then at least don't get in the > way, step down. Don't block people from doing their work by having them > wait for your feedback. >=20 > So volunteer work is fine, but as soon as the position grows "fangs" (=3D > a capacity to make others wait), then it becomes a promise, a > responsibility. >=20 > > > > 2) What is role and *responsibility* of Reviewer role? Is it > > documented somewhere? > > Per my observation, some assigned reviewers have never reviewed any > > patch in history or provided valuable feedback. To me, reviewer role > > seems more like a notification instead of really review something. Is > > that our purpose? >=20 > I'd say that's pretty close. A reviewer role is a request for keeping > the reviewer in the loop. Maintainers tend to appreciate that, because a > long-term reviewer may provide good insights, test results, and so on. > Trust is super important; a maintainer may push a patch based solely on > a reviewer's positive feedback, due to the latter's experience. >=20 > > While Laszlo contributed a lots in Tianocore community, he is really a > > good "reviewer", although he has no such title. >=20 > Thanks for the acknowledgement, I appreciate it! >=20 > I don't like to hoard titles. I'm sure titles are good for one's career, > but I always see the *promise* (the responsibility) to the community, > first and foremost, that a title encapsulates. It weighs heavily on me. > I loathe disappointing people. For me, not to bear a title is better > than to bear it and not to deliver on it / not to live up to it. >=20 > Laszlo -=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D- Groups.io Links: You receive all messages sent to this group. View/Reply Online (#110269): https://edk2.groups.io/g/devel/message/110269 Mute This Topic: https://groups.io/mt/102245264/7686176 Group Owner: devel+owner@edk2.groups.io Unsubscribe: https://edk2.groups.io/g/devel/unsub [rebecca@openfw.io] -=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-